George R. R. Martin Once Shared Frank Herbert’s Frustrations With Dune Fans

When “Game of Thrones” came out in 2011 (a whole 15 years after George R. R. Martin’s book was published), it became an instant phenomenon that changed television forever. Another 15 years later, the franchise has only gotten more expansive. Early 2026 ushered in the third spin-off in the franchise, with “A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms” bringing delightful fun and hopeful optimism to Westeros. Meanwhile, “House of the Dragon” is still going strong in its third season, and Warner Bros. is even threatening to unleash a movie trilogy about Aegon the Conqueror — the most boring idea for a film.

But what about Martin’s “A Song of Ice and Fire” series? You know, the incomplete book series that got butchered by an adaptation that quickly went off track? Well, we might just have a clue … in another book series.

Earlier this year, The Hollywood Reporter published an extensive interview with Martin. In it, he recalled a meeting he once had with Frank Herbert, the author of “Dune,” at a book convention in 1975. According to Martin, Herbert was getting tired of being asked for more “Dune” by both fans and publishers despite him having other ideas he wanted to pursue.

“He didn’t like ‘Dune’ anymore, and he didn’t want to write any more ‘Dune’ books,” Martin said. “But he felt locked in by the success of ‘Dune,’ so he kept writing them.” When the reporter asked if Martin could relate to Herbert, he answered: “I’m not necessarily tired of the world [of Ice and Fire],” he said. “I love the world and the world-building. But, yes, I do.”

Just like how the first three “Dune” books are by far the best in the series before Frank Herbert was forced to keep writing, the first three books in “A Song of Ice and Fire” are far and away the best three books in the series thus far. They were released in rapid succession, and contain the best writing and encapsulation of George R. R. Martin’s themes and ideas within the fantasy genre. After the third book, Martin became stuck, a victim of his own world-building. He notoriously wanted to start book 4 with a big time jump before deciding ultimately that it would require too much exposition. What has resulted is that Martin apparently doesn’t know how to reach the ending he planned, given that he keeps rewriting “The Winds of Winter” and going back and forth on whether to kill main characters. He’s clearly not satisfied with it, and maybe he’ll never be.

How does this relate to Herbert? It’s easy to see that George R. R. Martin is done with “A Song of Ice and Fire.” There is little incentive to finish the books, given that a version of the ending is out there via “Game of Thrones,” and no matter what he writes, it will only cause huge arguments and complaints from fans. “Winds of Winter,” like its two preceding books, was not part of Martin’s plan, but a chore he keeps putting on himself as he expands the world and keeps adding to the lore.

But he is in love with the world. So instead, he explores other things that excite him, much as Tolkien’s true love was “The Silmarillion,” with its collection of short stories, lore, and history.

One thing to remember is that George R. R. Martin is also a TV writer, and a very good one. In addition to a forgotten “Twilight Zone” episode, Martin has written for several shows, including a “Beauty and the Beast” adaptation. Some of the best episodes of “Game of Thrones” were all written by Martin. This is all to say that Martin is clearly interested in TV as a medium, and he loves getting involved in adaptations of his work.

If Martin has become tired of the expectations of having to finish “A Song of Ice and Fire” despite how impossibly hard it’s become for him to figure out the plotting of the rest of the series, maybe he should jump ship. Just stop, George, quit the novels and focus on what you truly like. With Warner Bros. clearly game for more titles set in Westeros, why not have Martin helm his own project? Let him pick one corner of his world and give him free rein to tell a story for TV or film that we haven’t seen or read before.

Hell, why not just go full-time with “Dunk and Egg?” Martin was quite involved in “A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms” and, by all measures, seems to love that production. If “A Song of Ice and Fire” no longer does it for him, let him focus on telling more Dunk and Egg stories for the rest of his life. Let him spend however long he has left on this planet on something he loves rather than being forced to cater to fan expectations and publisher demands. Maybe Martin can be the key to us actually getting the planned 12 seasons of “A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms.”